[asterisk-users] To use asterisk or proprietary hardware, that is the question

[shadowym]

Thanks Tom and everyone else,

Based largely on your comments I decided to just stick with what works.  I
have a site using entry level ATX server hardware that has been solid as a
rock.  I'll just go with that instead of more specialized fanless hardware,
specialized power supply and 2.5" hard drives etc.  Maybe get a second
motherboard as a spare of they go for the ongoing remote support option.  

I'll do some simple things like a put in a standby hard drive with the
production image on it in case the primary drive fails.  The case has hot
swap SATA bays so if the primary drive fails or get's corrupted anyone can
just swap drives and they will be back up just like that.  I'll make remote
offsite backups as well.

Thanks for all the help.

-----Original Message-----
From: Tom [mailto:tom at ispstuff.com] 
Sent: Saturday, February 24, 2007 5:01 PM
To: Asterisk Users Mailing List - Non-Commercial Discussion
Subject: Re: [asterisk-users] To use asterisk or proprietary hardware,that
is the question

At 11:53 AM 2/24/2007, you wrote:
>
>Hi there,
>
>Here is my dilema.  I have a new small business customer that wants me 
>to put in a VoIP phone system for them.  Based on their requirements, I 
>have determined that it needs to be a "set it and forget it" type of 
>thing like a lot of small business proprietary systems.

There is no such thing as set and forget.  Businesses change.  They either
grow or shrink, they don't stand still.  They will add and remove phones.
So they will call you at that time.  Or are you expecting them to shop for
their own phones on Ebay?


>At the same time they would like to be able to do minor dial plan 
>changes themselves so I have determine that a GUI like FreePBX or 
>similar alternative (free or commercial) is appropriate.

We take a different approach.  We don't want a GUI.  We don't want the
limits.  We work with the business to design their dial plan.  Then we write
it.  We do not give them a GUI because we don't want them making changes and
then asking for support.

We sell them a minor service agreement and remote in for any changes.  We
also handle professional voice recording and basic training on phone use.
And we handle backups and service if needed.  Once they understand that we
can do that without a service call, they are quite receptive to the idea.

Conventional PBXs come with service agreements so customers are used to that
but surprised at the low cost from you.


>I have some concerns about using Asterisk for this. As much as I am in
>support of the whole Asterisk revolution, I just do not feel confident
>enough in Asterisk on a Hard Drive as a "set it and forget it" setup
running
>month after month, year after year.  I am hoping someone can convince me
>otherwise.

Hard drives are reliable.  But I have similar feelings so we are 
working on a flash solution.  Were running it beta in our office 
right now. It only uses the hard drive for daily voicemail, boots 
from flash and runs from RAM.

>I'm concerned about hard drive corruptions/failures, memory
>leaks, software bugs etc.

Conventional systems have bugs too.

>  I have the budget to buy good quality hardware so
>if I was to go with Asterisk I would go industrial grade fanless computer,
>power conditioned UPS etc.

You don't really need fanless.  Make it cheap enough that it can 
easily be replaced.  Like a $500 PC.

>I am not concerned about the reliability of most
>of the hardware.  It's the hard drive and the software that runs on it that
>worries me.  I will obviously use a mature stable Asterisk release and the
>most stable Linux version which I won't bother naming just to keep the
>discussion focussed.

Asterisk is pretty darn stable.


>I have other Asterisk installs that went well but they were in environments
>where there were IT people around who were prepared to deal with some Linux
>administration and I could provide ongoing support for more major things.
>That is not the case here.  Some of those sites have been running for
months
>untouched, some needed some updates and reboots for various issues.  I
don't
>think this customer would look very favorably on me having to come in and
>add patches or have to reboot once a month or whatever.

So do it from home.  And how often do you really need to upgrade a 
minimal  read only flash based system with no dev tools running from 
RAM?  Does the latest kernel really matter?

>   Their expection is
>the same as they would have with any other phone system that mounts on the
>wall and "just works" for years.  I think that is a reasonable expectation.

Agreed.  And if it breaks, you replace it quickly and at a low cost.

>I am looking at putting in an Epygi proprietary VoIP system in instead.  It
>is mostly hardware based although apparently runs Linux.  It has a GUI, is
>supposedly plug and play most of the time, and most importantly, does not
>use a Hard Drive.  I have heard good things about them so for arguments
>sake, let's assume voice quality, features, and the enduser experience are
>approximately the same as using an Asterisk/Analog FXO Card/hardware echo
>cancel solution.  Flexibility, scalability, upgradeability are non-issues
>because the requirements are fixed.  The Eqygi will end up costing a few
>hundred dollars more but for arguments sake let's assume cost's are
>approximately the same.

Are you selling them service or passing them off to someone 
else?   Who will set up and support Egypi?  If you are servicing them 
then that is one more system that you have to learn, stock and 
support.  If you don't stock it, can they afford to be down for a day 
or longer waiting for a replacement?

>Astlinux would work except it does not currently meet some key requirements
>(GUI, Sangoma Analog card support).  Otherwise it would be a GREAT
>distribution for "set it and forget it" running without a Hard Drive IMHO.
>
>Anyways, I am hoping I can get enough positive feedback about "set it and
>forget it" experiences to convince me to use Asterisk/FreePBX instead of a
>more proprietary VoIP solution.  Either way I will be using the same SIP
>phones so that is a non-issue as well.

With proper hardware and support, they just run.  We do not reboot in 
a cron.   Our oldest is going on about 2 years.

>Basic Requirements are as follows:
>Wall Mount

No floor or shelf space in their wiring closet?

>*6 local network SIP extensions
>*4 remote SIP extension over ADSL or cable
>*4 incoming analog phone lines in a hunt group
>*features such as auto attendant, voicemail to email, forward to pager for
>after hours emergency etc.  Nothing too special
>
>Any help, advice, experiences etc. would be greatly appreciated.

Small, cheap, well made PC.  We are using a small Dell which is well 
built and easy to replace.  Sangoma A200 analog card.  Flash 
based.  Lots of testing.  You provide the support.

That's what we are doing.

Tom