[Asterisk-Users] Vonage a provider?

[Wiley Siler]

I don't feel I am mistreating you in asking you not to dump on a noob.  
Even if you do not think he is a noob and he is just lazy. 

You wrote:

	"Why answer? because I don't want this to happen again. But I
dont' care to help him/her or even you."

Maybe that is a mistake in what you wrote.  I read that as "I don't care
to help him or you".
Doesn't really matter though.  As stated before I was not asking.  Nor
will I be.

I am not making it any better?  Beating a dog does not make it stop
pissing on the carpet.
Taking it outside and teaching it to use the lawn does.  Which one of us
is beating the dog?

Some people get overwhelmed and research is missed. 
I agree that sometimes it is just sheer laziness but it is a list group
for petes sake. 
It is voluntary and no one is entitled to anything here. 
No one is entitled to low bandwidth usage.  
No one is entitled to an answer. 
Anyone who signs up gets what they get and we can all make it good or
bad.
If you don't like an email, delete it and move on.
If you are concerned with bandwidth usage, unsubscribe.
I have seen people complain about bandwidth or post count many times.
If anyone is a bandwidth miser then why are they signing up for a
mailing list?
I never have figured that one out.

No one is entitled to a low number of posts that have been vetted for
relevence 
and encompass the requests only the most worthy and learned of Asterisk
users.

There will be dumb questions, lazy questions, and silly questions.
Hell, I just asked a silly question 30 minutes ago.  It happens.
Bitchslapping the questioner accomplishes nothing.  
Nothing gets learned other than "Wow, those guys are rude".
Getting on this site does not equal competency.  
Many people can make it this far and just need to be taught the
etiquette and given the basic tour.
Getting frustrated over the extra emails is a waste of time.

Regardless, like I said.  I want the new guys to learn the ropes and
become old guys.
In all the most polite ways I mean this.  You do your thing.  I'll do
mine.
Which one of us will be helping the community?

The dog catcher who wants to euthenize all the noobs.
Or
The dog trainer that teachs them how to be part of the community?

The philisophical ball is in your court, though I would love to just
move on and call it good at this point.

Cheers,
Wiley






-----Original Message-----
From: C F [mailto:shmaltz at gmail.com] 
Sent: Friday, March 11, 2005 1:37 PM
To: Wiley Siler; Asterisk Users Mailing List - Non-Commercial Discussion
Subject: Re: [Asterisk-Users] Vonage a provider?

On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 13:16:23 -0700, Wiley Siler
<wsiler at education2020.com> wrote:

How is this apparent, I would be glad to help you, when you ask. I know
you didn't ask for my help.

> It is MORE than apparent that you do not want to help me.
> Fortunately, I am not asking for your help.
> 
> However, if you don't care to answer politely, then why answer at all?
Becuase that person is asking for help.

> Treating people crappy over an email is stupid.
So why are you doing it?


> Just ignore the noob and move on with your life if you don't want to 
> answer.
As I stated before this has nothing to do with the noob.
 
> Regardless, you seriously need to come to terms with the fact that it 
> WILL continue to happen.
I know it will, but you are not helping anything.

> New users will always equal people without a clue.
This is not true, if the research is done then they will have a clue.

> They will come here not knowing how to do anything or how to find 
> anything.
Then how did they end up here? they got an invite in the post?

> 
> <IMPORTANT DISTINCTION COMING>
> Whether they stay and become users, contributors, and purchasers of 
> service or equipment has a lot to do with how they are treated at the 
> outset.
> <IMPORTANT DISTINCTION COMPLETE>

This is about the only thing that you wrote that makes me think that
maybe I should have not put in the line about being lazy, so that person
stays around as a member of this community. But I doubt that this will
push him off (after what you wrote for sure not).

> If they do not KNOW that voip-info exists how are they supposed to 
> look there?

Again and again, how did they end up on this list? That's the same way
they could find out about the wiki.

> Because someone found the usergroup from Digium .com, they should know

> how to use Google to site:lists.digium.com?  Or they should 
> automatically know where the Wiki is?  I recognize that there are 
> links they could have followed but it is just "noobitis".  They get 
> overwhelmed or don't know the next move. Or maybe don't know the 
> etiquite.  If they are just drifting through and not destined to be 
> users, they will go away.  If they are destined to be users, we should

> shape them into good one. A good teacher would encourages them and 
> move on.  Not chastize them.
> 
> Research is the issue?  Then point them to where they should go and 
> let them do it.
> I agree with your general feelings on when people come here looking 
> for htings they should be able to get themselves.
> I just don't agree with how to handle it.
> For you, it would be better for everyone if you just deleted the email

> and ignored the person.
> You would be happy and the person who asked could get an answer from 
> someone else.
> Then we can correct the person so they can be a GOOD submitter to the 
> list.
> That way we all benefit.
> 
> Cheers,
> Wiley