[OT] - [Asterisk-Users] Why should I answer a Newbie question, therethick!

[Jeff Busch]

As someone who is new to Asterisk and Linux (I guess I am a newbie), but
who has been doing a ton of research, Google searches, and is getting to
intimately know the wiki, I take offense to Steven Critchfield's
commentary about newbies.

It is interesting... There seems to be a passion surrounding the *
system that is coming from a variety of work areas including telecom
engineers, network admins, and just home tinklers.  You have the
opportunity to provide a solution that many small to medium businesses
could take advantage of in amazing ways.  This is the tip of the
iceberg, * could play a major role in telecommunications in the future.
(I make these statements after having just dropped $120,000 on an
Inter-tel system a year ago, and having gone through the whole process
of evaluating a variety of systems.  Each system provided good features,
but it seemed like each of the feature sets provided in * ended up
costing at least a couple grand to add to our system... But this is
another discussion entirely.)

Unfortunately, I feel that you may end up pushing people away if you
keep attacking them.  There are people like myself who are decision
makers in using this technology and who actually have money to spend on
implementation.  If we needed to, we would hire someone from this group
to help us out.  It has not come to that yet for us, as I have been able
to implement most aspects without serious problems.

This list is for general Asterisk user questions... And from what I have
seen this is the best place for someone like myself to get a grip on the
different technical concepts related to *.  I believe that I, as what
you would refer to as a "Newbie", have just as much of a "right" to ask
a question about setting up *, as a seasoned * user has the "right" to
ask questions relating to implementing a more complex technology and
getting help for a problem.

Now, to offer a solution, and I don't know if this is possible, as I
know nothing about the mechanics behind this list... Is it possible to
automatically send an email to each new subscriber after they confirm
their email that gives them some basic "how-to's" related to this list
i.e.  (this is what I have done)

1. Before asking a question, do a Google search
2. After a general Google search, do a specific search on this group
3. After a Google search, look at http://www.voip-info.org/wiki-Asterisk
the information contained in these pages will answer 95% of your startup
questions.
4. If you have done 1, 2, & 3 - feel free to email the list.
5. Please do not email the list asking people to hold your hand.  That
is not what the list is for, it is for help if you run into an
implementation problem, not to teach you the basics by using 1, 2, & 3.


Thanks for your thoughts on this!

Jeff Busch
jeff.busch at lewisbuilds.com

-----Original Message-----
From: asterisk-users-bounces at lists.digium.com
[mailto:asterisk-users-bounces at lists.digium.com] On Behalf Of Shadow
Roldan
Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 4:32 PM
To: Asterisk Users Mailing List - Non-Commercial Discussion
Subject: [OT] - [Asterisk-Users] Why should I answer a Newbie
question,therethick!

If you really want to do this the asterisk list is based off of mailman.

You can learn all about mailman here:

http://list.org/

But really, what are the odds that newbs will know to go there first?
Are you going to moderate it? Someone has to actually answer the
questions you know, if a newb only list is going to exist.

Look, don't answer lame questions if you don't want to. Flaming a newb
for being a newb is just mean. (they will eventually RTFM or STFW or
they will fail). This is the way of the open source community. 

Otherwise, they can hire one of the many companies that have sprung up
around supporting open source products (tons for asterisk specifically,
some of you probably even get paid this way) why do you think redhat
makes so much on support contracts? Personally, I'm only not a newb
cause I paid for a training class to get me out newbieism(sp?)

My 2 cents

-----Original Message-----
From: asterisk-users-bounces at lists.digium.com
[mailto:asterisk-users-bounces at lists.digium.com] On Behalf Of Race
Vanderdecken
Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2005 8:57 AM
To: 'Asterisk Users Mailing List - Non-Commercial Discussion'
Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] Why should I answer a Newbie
question,therethick!

If some one would like to show me the site that explains how to setup a
mailing list then I will create a Newbie list for asterisk and voip
questions and answers.

I am only asking for someone to show me the site and maybe a few
pointers on how to start it up. Only because I don't have the time or
experience to do it quickely enough to get the newbies off the list. And
I am a bit slow with apache and web type sutff, as you can tell by my
website codetyrant.com.

I will personally pay for the hosting of the list.

It is not that I am tired or will ever grow tired of passing out fish
and giving fishing lessons it is just I don't have the good fortune to
be adept at web interfaces.

Also, suggestions for the domain name would be welcomed. 

Race "The Tyrant" Vanderdecken

"In the Land of the Blind, the One-eyed man is Elvis...", copyright RPV
1997.


-----Original Message-----
From: asterisk-users-bounces at lists.digium.com
[mailto:asterisk-users-bounces at lists.digium.com] On Behalf Of Steven
Critchfield
Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2005 11:28 AM
To: Asterisk Users Mailing List - Non-Commercial Discussion
Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] Why should I answer a Newbie
question,therethick!

On Wed, 2005-03-02 at 11:01 -0500, Race Vanderdecken wrote:
> This list is owned by no one.

Actually it is owned by Digium. It has many contributers though.

> When someone drives off the road into a ditch in a snow storm they
last
> thing they need is someone telling them they should have invested in 
> snow chains and defensive driving lessons before leaving the house.
> 
> Newbies need help getting out of the ditch so traffic can continue to 
> flow and the rubber neckers can be abated. If you are not willing to 
> pull off to the side of the road and help the fool by pushing their
car
> out of the ditch you have no right to give him the finger as you drive

> past.

As a person who spent 9 hours in traffic last winter just to drive 15
miles due to idiots who should have just stayed home, I think your
analogy breaks down. 

At some point, you either need to learn to drive or you pay someone else
to transport you or your stuff. Same applies to computer work, either
you can do the work yourself or you pay someone else to do it. Even your
snow driver analogy works here, you either get yourself out of the ditch
or you pay someone to do it for you. 

The payment is not always monetary. Sometimes the payment is just a
showing of sufficient effort. Back to your snow driver analogy, if the
driver in the ditch is just waiting in the car for you to come over and
push them out without even attempting anything on their own, you would
be less inclined to bother. You would be even less inclined to continue
exerting your own effort if the driver was not cooperating or wasn't
even interested in getting out to help push.
--
Steven Critchfield <critch at basesys.com>