[Asterisk-Users] Little confused about Caller ID

[C F]

Sorry, in the post I wrote:
I used to work with an Avaya Difinity G3. We had PRI, which gave us
incoming CallerID (Name Only),
It should read:
I used to work with an Avaya Difinity G3. We had PRI, which gave us
incoming CallerID (Number Only),
Sorry for the mistake.
And to Mr Tom C. thanks a million.


On Sun, 9 Jan 2005 20:43:28 -0600, Tom Chandler <tchandle at bayou.com> wrote:
> These comments are based on domestic SS7.  International SS7 works different
> and
> when you internetwork between domestic and international SS7 everything
> changes.
> Sorry about long post......
> TC.
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "C F" <shmaltz at gmail.com>
> To: "Asterisk Users Mailing List - Non-Commercial Discussion"
> <asterisk-users at lists.digium.com>
> Sent: Sunday, January 09, 2005 7:14 PM
> Subject: Re: [Asterisk-Users] Little confused about Caller ID
> 
> > Without going into detail of what the query is actualy called, when
> > the called switch make the query to find out the name, does it ask it
> > from the originating switch? or it askes it from the switch that is
> > responsibble for servicing the number?
> 
> In the SS7 Data stream, the originating switch populates the IAM message in
> which the
> calling party number and some other flags are loaded.  The originating
> switch can block
> the terminating switch from doing a CNAME lookup.  This flag comes for the
> Line Switch
> Record in the originating switch.  But lets assume that it is not blocked.
> The originating switch
> populates the IAM message with the calling party name.  If the terminating
> number has
> callerid set, then the terminating switch will take the number from the SS7
> record and do a
> TCAP query for calling name.  So the originating switch will pass via the
> SS7 IAM record
> the calling party number.
> 
> 
> > The difference would be if, I have a PRI from provider A, and a number
> > from provider B, and thru provider A a make an outgoing call using the
> > callerID of provider B, who recieves the query?
> 
> If your originating PBX or Switch does not have SS7 connection to up stream
> switches, what will get loaded is the POTS number loaded with the PRI. This
> assumes that it is Feature Group D.  If it is a 23B+D and your PBX can
> support
> it, over the D channel you can send a calling party number that can be
> passed via
> the next switch into the SS7 record if they will.  IT can be done, but may
> not
> based on tariffs, etc.
> 
> > In my experrience it doesn't matter, b/c most providers will anyhow
> > ignore the name you send and just send the number (or is it the called
> > switch that ignores it, and then makes the name query), and since I
> > don't know how a query like this works I don't know why my provider
> > doesn't answer with the name I supplied, if it is the one being asked,
> > I beleive it will not generate names on the fly even if it the one
> > being queried. But if the calling switch is the one being queried then
> > it would at least in theory be possible to answer what ever I wanted.
> > But if it askes the servicing switch (provider B) then it is not even
> > possible to change it (at least thru A).
> 
> CNAME is designed to work on the terminating switch, the originating
> switch via SS7 supplies the calling party number and what is referred to
> as the FCI's.  (Forward calling indicators)
> 
> >
> > I used to work with an Avaya Difinity G3. We had PRI, which gave us
> > incoming CallerID (Name Only), and outgoing CallerID, since we had DID
> > we set up the Difinity to send the DID as CallerID, we however also
> > wanted that the name of the associated extension should come up, we
> > were then told by our provider that the name will always be the
> > billing name and there is nothing we can do. One day however a call
> > came in from another company using a PRI, and a Difinity and the name
> > of the remote extension came up, which leads me to believe that the
> > name is sent along on PRI (remember on our PRI we never got incoming
> > Name on CallerID). But it is ignored by the switches on the way, if
> > the called end is analog the switch does the query (igonring the name
> > that is sent, and sending the result of the query as the name), but if
> > the called end is PRI it does not do a query (I guess it relies on
> > your switch to do it), however it is sent along, on the PRI end your
> > switch (in my case the Difinity) just has to read it, since our switch
> > spoke the same language as the sending switch it received it and the
> > name showed up on CallerID (we were both using a Difinity).
> > Some clearfication please.
> 
> I retired from AT&T Labs.  Worked on these switches in a networking
> config, using 23B + D.  The D channel can work as somewhat of a SS7
> link.  Maybe that is what Asterisk should look at instead of SS7
> connections.
> To me Asterisk would work better if it could use the D channel for what
> the D channel was designed for, instead of using system resources for SS7.
> SS7 really works best in a TDM to TDM world.You can pass numbers out
> of the PBX via the D channel to the upstream switch for inclusion in the IAM
> message.
>  Then next problem, is your upstream switch going to load these
> names/numbers in
>  the CNAME database.
> If not then you will not get anything on the far end.  CNAME is a revenue
> generator
> for teleco.  Other telecos must pay a dip charge for looking up remote
> names.
> 
> I have been looking at Asterisk and how to do local CNAME lookups based on
> far end calls.  I can lookup based on NPA/NXX and get City State out of
> MySQL.
> Working on adding international.
> 
> Hope post was not too long, but will be glad to try and answer any other
> questions.
> Tom C.
> > Thanks.
> >
> >
> > On Sun, 9 Jan 2005 18:40:33 -0600, Tom Chandler <tchandle at bayou.com>
> wrote:
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Alexander Lopez" <alex.lopez at opsys.com>
> > > To: "Asterisk Users Mailing List - Non-Commercial Discussion"
> > > <asterisk-users at lists.digium.com>
> > > Sent: Sunday, January 09, 2005 5:55 PM
> > > Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] Little confused about Caller ID
> > >
> > > > Thanks. I was always under the impression that they were all separate
> > > > tables in the same DB and that they were collectively called 'The
> > > > LIDB!!'
> > > >
> > > > For my and the others here could you describe the function of the
> > > > different DBs?
> > > >
> > > > I now understand the CNAME, I thought I knew the LIBD, I can guess on
> > > > the LNP, and 800, but what about the AIN???
> > > >
> > >
> > > AIN = Advanced Intellignet Network.  This is the area were a large
> number of
> > > new
> > > applications in the SS7 world are going.    Followme calling, and some
> > > others.
> > > Some of the auto callback features, speed dial, etc.  These application
> are
> > > stored
> > > in a database, and again require a TCAP query to make them work.
> > >
> > > There are other databases assoicated with Cellular that are completely
> > > different from the
> > > TDM world.
> > >
> > > > BTW. I was under the impression the fields had been added to the LIDB
> to
> > > > handle the Do Not Call list. Can anyone confirm or deny??
> > >
> > > I have not seen any documentation on this.  I think a large number of
> people
> > > get
> > > LIDB and the Line Record Set which is in the switch interchanged.  The
> Line
> > > Record Set
> > > is the record in the switch which configures the 7 digit line.  There
> are
> > > many flags in this record.
> > > You can block Caller ID, Caller Name, auto callback, block out going LD,
> > > etc.  The LIBD record
> > > is in an SCP. The LIBD record and the Line Switch record are two
> different
> > > items.
> > >
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: asterisk-users-bounces at lists.digium.com
> > > > [mailto:asterisk-users-bounces at lists.digium.com] On Behalf Of Tom
> > > > Chandler
> > > > Sent: Sunday, January 09, 2005 6:54 PM
> > > > To: Asterisk Users Mailing List - Non-Commercial Discussion
> > > > Subject: Re: [Asterisk-Users] Little confused about Caller ID
> > > >
> > > > TCAP is a transaction application.  The CNAME, LIDB,800,.LNP and AIN
> > > > database COULD
> > > > be in the same SCP, but in most cases it is not.  LIDB database are
> used
> > > > for
> > > > calling card, operator
> > > > services, etc.  These are all seperate databases stored for use in an
> > > > SCP
> > > > connected to STP's.
> > > > So is there a relationship between CNAME and LIBD, no.
> > > > Tom C.
> > > >
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "Alexander Lopez" <alex.lopez at opsys.com>
> > > > To: "Asterisk Users Mailing List - Non-Commercial Discussion"
> > > > <asterisk-users at lists.digium.com>
> > > > Sent: Sunday, January 09, 2005 5:44 PM
> > > > Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] Little confused about Caller ID
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > Is the TCAP DB part of the LIDB collective (no Borg pun intended)??
> > > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: asterisk-users-bounces at lists.digium.com
> > > > > [mailto:asterisk-users-bounces at lists.digium.com] On Behalf Of Tom
> > > > > Chandler
> > > > > Sent: Sunday, January 09, 2005 6:45 PM
> > > > > To: Asterisk Users Mailing List - Non-Commercial Discussion; C F
> > > > > Subject: Re: [Asterisk-Users] Little confused about Caller ID
> > > > >
> > > > > Caller Name is stored in a SCP.  It is a TCAP transaction.  The
> > > > > receiving
> > > > > switch via SS7 recieves
> > > > > the calling party number in the ISUP message of the SS7 datastream.
> > > > It
> > > > > is
> > > > > normally in the IAM mesasge.  Then a TCAP CNAME query is launched
> from
> > > > > the
> > > > > called switch thru
> > > > > the STP's to a SCP which has the calling name database.  The TCAP
> > > > query
> > > > > returns back to the launching
> > > > > switch the caller name.  LIDB is for operator services etc. CNAME is
> a
> > > > > TCAP
> > > > > database lookup, much
> > > > > like 800 number translations.
> > > > >
> > > > > Tom C.
> > > > >
> > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > From: "Alexander Lopez" <alex.lopez at opsys.com>
> > > > > To: "C F" <shmaltz at gmail.com>; "Asterisk Users Mailing List -
> > > > > Non-Commercial
> > > > > Discussion" <asterisk-users at lists.digium.com>
> > > > > Sent: Sunday, January 09, 2005 5:30 PM
> > > > > Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] Little confused about Caller ID
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > OK here it goes..
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Caller ID is two parts or actually three:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Part 1 Number only
> > > > > > Part 2 Number + Name
> > > > > > Part 3 Whole lotta stuff (also known as ADSI)
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Here is the US, I cannot speak for other countries.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > When party A places a call to Party B. Party A's Telco picks up
> the
> > > > > > number, either from a table on the switch or passed from the PRI
> > > > from
> > > > > > Party A.  Then on the far side (Party B's Telco) the Telco does a
> > > > > lookup
> > > > > > in the LIDB (Line Information Data Base) and associates a name
> with
> > > > a
> > > > > > number. This information is then passed as Part II CLID.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I have simplified the process, leaving out many processes along
> the
> > > > > way
> > > > > > but it should give some insight as to how the Name actually shows
> up
> > > > > on
> > > > > > the other end.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Most Telcos do not receive the Name as part of the data in the
> call
> > > > > > through the tandems b/w Telcos, they opt rather to do the lookup
> in
> > > > > the
> > > > > > LIDB themselves.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > From: asterisk-users-bounces at lists.digium.com
> > > > > > [mailto:asterisk-users-bounces at lists.digium.com] On Behalf Of C F
> > > > > > Sent: Sunday, January 09, 2005 6:16 PM
> > > > > > To: Asterisk Users Mailing List - Non-Commercial Discussion
> > > > > > Subject: Re: [Asterisk-Users] Little confused about Caller ID
> > > > > >
> > > > > > When calling to the PSTN (outside VOIP or *) then you will not be
> > > > able
> > > > > > to supply the name of callerID even if you have a PRI. The only
> > > > thing
> > > > > > you can provide is the number and the receiving switch of the call
> > > > is
> > > > > > the one responsibble for attaching a name to the phone number thru
> > > > > > SS7. If you have a SS7 switch then you could in theory attach the
> > > > name
> > > > > > (I have never tried it, but that's what I was told).
> > > > > > Hope this helps.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> 
>