[asterisk-users] Royalty for On Hold Music ?

[Stephen Bosch]

John Novack wrote:
>> The fact that ASCAP goes on "campaigns" doesn't make it any less absurd
>> (or, for that matter, any more likely that the average business is going
>> to be taken to task); the reality is that thousands upon thousands of
>> interconnects install PBX systems with radio ports on them that are
>> plugged into cheap transistor radios bought at Wal-Mart and similar
>> places, and nobody -- not the client, nor the interconnect -- has any
>> clue about any royalty obligations that entails. People do it, think
>> nothing of it (not least because the PBX vendors promote it as a
>> feature!) and I think neither ASCAP nor any other royalty agency has the
>> necessary resources to make even a dent in this kind of use.
>>   
> Simply put - tell it to the judge.

As soon as I see one, I'd be happy to.

> Drivers speed , change lanes, cut others off every day and MOSTLY get 
> away with it.
> Doesn't make it legal, does it?

The difference between that and the piped-in radio is that drivers who
speed, change lanes and cut others off *know* they are breaking the law,
and most people who pipe "The Fuzz 104" into their waiting rooms neither
 "know they are breaking the law", nor do they much care. They can
switch to NPR if they get a letter.

Seriously -- this is totally unenforceable, and most reasonable people
would take a legal threat to stop "listening to the radio" (which is how
they're going to see it) as ridiculous and insulting, even if they *do*
end up complying.

> Not any different than stealing software is it?

I happen to think that listening to commercial radio broadcast over
public airwaves, whether it's over the speaker in the ceiling or the
radio on my porch, is a whole lot different from stealing software, yes.

>> It's one thing if you're Dell or Microsoft and you are using music for your call centre, and another if you're the neighbourhood dental practice.
>>   
> In the eyes of the law, it makes NO difference.

Lots of things are ugly in the eyes of the law. That doesn't change how
people actually behave. Only real consequences do.

I'm talking about what is happening on the street here, not the world as
you prefer to see it. I have no trouble seeing the dollar signs in the
eyes of the legal barracudas on the payroll of the various licencing
agencies; that doesn't make their enforcement right, reasonable, or
actually happen, for that matter. There are practical limitations on how
many Mom and Pop operations they can go after.

> Do it until you are caught, you say?

Hey -- *I'm* not doing it :) I'm just looking around at the thousands of
people around me who are.

The music business has a horrible public perception problem, and also an
enforcement problem. Chasing after people who are piping commercial
radio into their premises only alienates more of the general public, the
very people they are trying to get to buy their product.

I'm merely relaying the reaction of the average independent business
person to such a request: "You want me to do *what*? Come *on*."

>> I'd be interested in getting in touch with any small businesses which have been given a "cease and desist" letter or demand for payment because they piped radio into their phone systems.
> Not only their phone systems but their waiting rooms
> 
> Next time you go into an office or store and you see the yellow ASCAP 
> label on the door, you know they probably have gotten a letter.

I have never, ever seen such a label on the door of any professional
office. Feel free to introduce me to someone who has one (and I'm not
kidding.)

> MANY interconnects now have discovered they can make extra by selling a 
> message on hold system that not only hawks the wares of the firm but 
> escapes the clutches of ASCAP.

Introduce me to some. I'm always keen to learn.

> You remind me of a friend who enjoys a good argument with a tree stump.

I only argue with stumps that talk. *You* remind me of the guy on the
freeway who calls the highway patrol because somebody cut someone else off.

I felt compelled to speak up because I see a certain constituency that
snaps to salute when big money waves an attorney's letter in their
faces. There are lots of laws on the books that nobody pays heed to
anymore, like town by-laws which say the mayor has to give a guy he's
just kicked out of town a horse and a week's rations. Laws are written
by people for people (more often, by people to serve the interests of
certain other people) and for specific contexts and circumstances. They
serve a purpose. They are not stone slabs that Moses brought down from
the mountain. That's the reason why community standards matter in the
enforcement of the law.

As they say in the military: the map is not the territory.

Again, please introduce me to someone who's been threatened or served
because they were piping radio somewhere (even better, someone who has
lost a court action because of it). I would like to be educated.

-Stephen-