<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Marcelo Pacheco <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:marcelo@m2j.com.br">marcelo@m2j.com.br</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
Gustavo,<br>
<br>
I think you're confusing the general function of an STP with the
external signaling network architecture used by ANSI countries.<br>
<br>
All incumbent networks in Brazil make heavy usage of STPs.<br>
They have lots of </div></blockquote><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> TDM switches, and to avoid a full mesh of
signaling links between all TDM switches that have voice trunks
between them, STPs are used to aggregate SS7 traffic.<br></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>STP is single point of failure unless used in pairs; using STP pairs requires combined linkset - does ITU have this capability? don't think so - SLS is only 4 bits; it's 5 bits in ANSI </div>
<div><br></div><div>of course it is what it is - but i'm curious how the fault tolerance vs management ease balance out - mildly curious</div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
<br>
Also STPs are also used as billing entities and for resolving LNP in
some carriers.<br>
<br></div></blockquote><div>This seems to me to be the motivation for using STPs.</div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
I'm pretty sure STPs have lots of usage in other ITU countries.<br>
<br></div></blockquote><div>Poland. "Lots" is a relative term. You do see them. Seems like they were being introduced about the same time that VoIP was coming in too. Now what? Keep building TDM or cap it and go to VoIP? I think we all know how that is turning out.</div>
<div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
However they don't have a fully separate signaling network, 64kbps
SS7 links make maximum usage of semi permanent call setups,
specially for interconnects with other carriers (using bearer
channels of existing E1 voice trunks).<br>
<br>
However competitive carriers use redundant soft switch architecture
don't need STPs, since signaling flows through the IP network,
without explicit signaling channels.<br>
<br>
I fell more important than the capability of Asterisk performing as
an STP, is much more important full linkset functionality as a
regular signaling point. For instance, the following scenario can't
be implemented with libss7 today:<br>
<br>
<tt>Asterisk --x-- STP A ---x--- Switch1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8<br>
STP B<br>
</tt><br>
Where Asterisk has voice CICs with all 8 switches, and all signaling
needs to be shared across a pair of signaling links, one with each
STP. Specially with E1s with all 8 switches can't fit on a single
Asterisk box.</div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Are you describing the combined linkset? When I've seen things like this in ITU networks, A was primary and B was alternate (used when A was not available), instead of the ANSI model where A and B are peers and normally used equally using a 5 bit SLS.</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><br>
<br>
Marcelo Pacheco</font></span><div><div class="h5"><br>
<br>
On 03/15/12 14:39, Gustavo Mársico wrote:
<blockquote type="cite"><br>
<div>
<div>On Mar 15, 2012, at 2:17 PM, Michael Mueller wrote:</div>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">STPs in ITU-land are awkward since ITU
voice networks are a mesh of E1 with signaling in the same
bundles as the voice
<div> <br>
<div>in ANSI-land, the STP was incorporated and mandated by
two large and powerful monopolies: BC and ATT; signaling
became de-coupled from the voice and traveling in a
separate network connected by hierarchy of mated pair STPs</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>putting an STP or an STP-like invention in an typical
ITU network raises questions about commercial viability:
having a central STP might raise your E1 charges because
they travel over longer distances - this raises monthly
charges in many places; might be cheaper to connect
locally - but then you have increased monthly charges for
colo space</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>there is conceptual dissonance between STPs and ITU
networks - STPs require the signaling be separate from the
voice, and ITU mesh networks are built around signaling
and voice channels traveling in the same bundles of wire
(i've just restated my first 2 paragraphs); decoupling
signaling means using an entire E1 for a single signal
channel; this usually causes despair to the typical ITU
ss7 engineer but is business as usual to the ANSI
counterpart</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
This is not quite correct. CALA region mostly uses separate E1
for signalling and media when a STP is used. If STP is not
required, some telco choose to separate and others don't. As the
same as ANSI does. In fact, it's a matter of how the people
wants to make it work.</div>
<div><br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div>the cheapest STP I know of is the PT Segway; maybe you
can get a Tekelec Eagle; I'm not aware of any Linux based
DIY STPs; ss7box started as an STP but evolved away from
the function as there was little need for a low-end STP in
ANSI-land and zero need for it in ITU-land</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>ss7box supports Asterisk box clustering around a single
point code with CIC routing; clustering might be something
you want to investigate - you'd have to examine the
technical, commercial, and incumbent connection policies
to see if it would help you build an IP voice network with
fewer connections to the incumbent telco network using
such a clustering function </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>you asked a complicated question, or I've turned a
simple question into a complicated one - both are
plausible</div>
<div><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Mar 15, 2012 at 11:45 AM,
Rodrigo Ricardo Passos <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:rodrigopassos@gmail.com" target="_blank">rodrigopassos@gmail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> Michael,<br>
<br>
Can you explain more?<br>
Here, in Brazil, the standard is ITU. I think it
isn´t possible because ITU is used in all telcos.<br>
<br>
<br>
Em 15/03/2012 12:25, Michael Mueller escreveu:
<div>
<div>
<blockquote type="cite">connecting a mated pair
of STPs to an ANSI network as a peer has more
requirements than connecting an SSP; ITU STP
are less common so connection requirements
might be more variable<br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Mar 15, 2012
at 10:19 AM, Rodrigo Ricardo Passos <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:rodrigopassos@gmail.com" target="_blank">rodrigopassos@gmail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
Gustavo,<br>
<br>
Do you know Yate? Knows if Yate can be
used in place of asterisk?<br>
I know that this list is about Asterisk
SS7, but I think that this question
doesn´t bad.<br>
<br>
Regards,<br>
<br>
Rodrigo<br>
<br>
Em 14/03/2012 16:55, Gustavo Mársico
escreveu:
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>There is no pure STP
implementation on libss7 or
chan_ss7. Modules cannot send TFA,
TFP, support STP timers, etc. Today,
all you can do is routing based in
the extensions, but that's not STP
function.</div>
<div>However, I know that some efforts
were made on libss7 and the last
time I checked looked promising.
I'll try to find what's going on
there.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Regards</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Gustavo</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<br>
<div>
<div>On Mar 14, 2012, at 4:39 PM,
Rodrigo Ricardo Passos wrote:</div>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> Hi all,<br>
<br>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">I have a
question of how can I create
STPs Boxes with Asterisk in
my network?</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">My project
includes a creation of
network with asterisk SPs
and STPs and my initial idea
is a implementation of these
boxes using TDMoE. So,
create two boxes like STP e
another’s boxes like SP.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">All
signalization will pass to
both STPs. Anyone knows if
my scenario will be one
scenario with a real STP
boxes or this will never STP
ambient?</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Other question
is, if this last question is
false, how can I create this
ambient with asterisk?<br>
</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
Best Regards,<br>
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Rodrigo<br>
<span lang="EN-US"></span></p>
<br>
<span><font color="#888888"> </font></span></div>
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