[asterisk-biz] India VoIP termination - FRAUD- BE Careful
Vlasis Hatzistavrou (KTI)
vhatz at kinetix.gr
Mon Nov 16 16:54:26 CST 2009
Indeed, usually they don't when it comes to old companies with a long
history, and only as long as you can prove a rock solid point/case. We
have faced some ugly situations even with "respectable" companies who
were in the telecoms business for a decade or more. If we had not
covered many possible angles we would literally have been cheated out of
thousands of dollars.
On the other hand, a new company with a very short history does not have
that much of a reputation to jeopardize by fraudulent practices.
Wes Reece wrote:
> True, but most companies don't throw their reputations away.
>
>
>
>
> 2009/11/15 Vlasis Hatzistavrou (KTI) <vhatz at kinetix.gr
> <mailto:vhatz at kinetix.gr>>
>
> Well, trade references, due diligence etc are usually OK, but since
> these things refer to the past of a company, you never know when/if this
> company which you just decided to get in business with decides to turn
> to the "dark side"...
>
> I mean future payments are not 100% guaranteed because of a good past.
>
> Best regards,
> Vlasis Hatzistavrou.
>
> Wes Reece wrote:
> > What about simply asking for trade references and due diligence
> on your
> > potential customer?
> >
> >
> > 2009/11/3 Vlasis Hatzistavrou (KTI) <vhatz at kinetix.gr
> <mailto:vhatz at kinetix.gr>
> > <mailto:vhatz at kinetix.gr <mailto:vhatz at kinetix.gr>>>
> >
> > Of, course, the escrow agent has to actually do something
> more than just
> > "guard" the money.
> >
> > Now there are escrow agencies which receive CDRs from both
> parties in
> > real time or in bathes every few hours. So, in case of a
> dispute the
> > escrow agent acts as a referee, too.
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Vlasis Hatzistavrou.
> >
> >
> > Mindaugas Kezys wrote:
> > >>From our experience escrow is not good choice either.
> Other side
> > can argue
> > > that service was bad/unusable and you will not get paid
> for it.
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > > Mindaugas Kezys
> > > http://www.kolmisoft.com
> > > VoIP Billing and Routing Solutions
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com>
> > <mailto:asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com>>
> > > [mailto:asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com>
> > <mailto:asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com>>] On Behalf Of Vlasis
> > > Hatzistavrou (KTI)
> > > Sent: 2009 m. lapkričio 2 d. 13:54
> > > To: Commercial and Business-Oriented Asterisk Discussion
> > > Subject: Re: [asterisk-biz] India VoIP termination - FRAUD- BE
> > Careful
> > >
> > > Just my 2 cents: there are escrow, exchange &
> clearinghouse services
> > > that one can use in order to secure business.
> > >
> > > Simple prepay/postpay nowadays is too dangerous, not only with
> > small &
> > > unknown operators but even with large & well known
> carriers. They too
> > > will dispute just about anything...
> > >
> > > Best regards,
> > > Vlasis Hatzistavrou.
> > >
> > >
> > > Andy Spring wrote:
> > >> Hi Dennis, first I am sorry to hear your bad news, but i can
> > give you
> > >> some suggestion, most of business men are trust parterns,
> only very
> > >> little are frauds, yes, sometimes, it is very difficult
> to find
> > out who
> > >> is sincerely and who is not, but you can test them from a
> very small
> > >> order starting after you have dealt many many small business
> > >> succesfully, then start big orders or stop contact with them.
> > >>
> > >> 2009/11/2 <info at dialontel.com <mailto:info at dialontel.com>
> <mailto:info at dialontel.com <mailto:info at dialontel.com>>
> > <mailto:info at dialontel.com <mailto:info at dialontel.com>
> <mailto:info at dialontel.com <mailto:info at dialontel.com>>>>
> > >>
> > >> Hi Andy and Everyone in this Forum,
> > >>
> > >> Of course Andy we are very Angry. Last Year in total
> we lost
> > over
> > >> 30K USD and Asia Telecom and BroadTelephone 3K USD
> invoice
> > is part
> > >> of it. This has effect our business process to do
> much more
> > >> verification in giving post pay/prepay and it has
> become almost
> > >> impossible find out who is geniune and who is not.
> > >>
> > >> Even though These two companies are registered in UK
> and USA its
> > >> managed and owned by Pakistan guys (nothing personal to
> > >> Pakistanies) so my point is we can not judge a
> company from
> > where it
> > >> is registered.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> So I bilieve most effective way to minimize frauds is to
> > keep close
> > >> contact with trusted partners and their frauds, so
> you can
> > keep away
> > >> from frauds.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Thanks,
> > >> Dennis S.
> > >> DialOnTel Team
> > >> <http://www.dialontel/>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> -------- Original Message --------
> > >> Subject: Re: [asterisk-biz] India VoIP termination -
> > FRAUD- BE
> > >> Careful
> > >> From: Andy Spring <andyspr at gmail.com
> <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com>
> > <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com>>
> <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com>
> > <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com>>>>
> > >> Date: Sun, November 01, 2009 5:15 am
> > >> To: Commercial and Business-Oriented Asterisk
> Discussion
> > >> <asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com>
> > <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com>>
> > >> <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com>
> > <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com>>>>
> > >>
> > >> Haha... Maybe Dennis is very angry with them,
> but what
> > make me
> > >> suprised is that the frauds are from UK and USA,
> whose
> > >> reputation are good and they also think
> themselves come with
> > >> good reputation, but also rubbish
> > >>
> > >> 2009/10/31 <info at dialontel.com
> <mailto:info at dialontel.com>
> > <mailto:info at dialontel.com <mailto:info at dialontel.com>>
> <mailto:info at dialontel.com <mailto:info at dialontel.com>
> > <mailto:info at dialontel.com <mailto:info at dialontel.com>>>>
> > >>
> > >> Hi All,
> > >>
> > >> DO NOT sell any minutes to BroadTelepone or
> AsiaTelecom.
> > >> They have a pending invoice to us for last 8
> months 3000
> > >> USD. Our company name is DialOnTel. we were
> seling
> > India to
> > >> them. These companies are fraud based in UK
> and USA.
> > >> AsiaTelecom UK is currently on liquadation.
> > >>
> > >> Sikander - Director, Faruk -Tech guy never
> response
> > to our
> > >> calls or emails.
> > >>
> > >> DO NOT Give post pay to them.
> > >>
> > >> My name is Dennis from DialOnTel.
> > >> dennis at dialontel.com
> <mailto:dennis at dialontel.com> <mailto:dennis at dialontel.com
> <mailto:dennis at dialontel.com>>
> > <mailto:dennis at dialontel.com <mailto:dennis at dialontel.com>
> <mailto:dennis at dialontel.com <mailto:dennis at dialontel.com>>>
> > >> info at dialontel.com
> <mailto:info at dialontel.com> <mailto:info at dialontel.com
> <mailto:info at dialontel.com>>
> > <mailto:info at dialontel.com <mailto:info at dialontel.com>
> <mailto:info at dialontel.com <mailto:info at dialontel.com>>>
> > >>
> > >> Sikander if you see this email you are most
> welcome to
> > >> contact me as you never response to our
> emials or calls.
> > >>
> > >> Thanks,
> > >> DialOnTel Team
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> -------- Original Message --------
> > >> Subject: Re: [asterisk-biz] India VoIP
> termination
> > >> From: Sikander Saeed
> <sikander at asiatele.net <mailto:sikander at asiatele.net>
> > <mailto:sikander at asiatele.net <mailto:sikander at asiatele.net>>
> > >> <mailto:sikander at asiatele.net
> <mailto:sikander at asiatele.net>
> > <mailto:sikander at asiatele.net <mailto:sikander at asiatele.net>>>>
> > >> Date: Fri, October 30, 2009 4:04 pm
> > >> To: Commercial and Business-Oriented Asterisk
> > Discussion
> > >> <asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com>
> > <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com>>
> > >> <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com>
> > <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com>>>>
> > >>
> > >> BroadTelephone is based in USA and involve in
> > wholesale
> > >> and retail VoIP services in USA, Canada
> and UK since
> > >> last decade. We are looking for quality
> route to
> > India.
> > >> Our targets are:
> > >>
> > >> India 919 mobile $0.0110
> > >> India 9194 $0.0125
> > >> India ROC 91 $0.0150
> > >> India Cities $0.0130
> > >>
> > >> Our daily traffic is about 25,000 minutes
> per day.
> > >> Please let us know if you can provide
> such service.
> > >>
> > >> Sikander Saeed
> > >> BroadTelephone, Inc.
> > >> www.broadtelephone.com
> <http://www.broadtelephone.com>
> > <http://www.broadtelephone.com> <http://www.broadtelephone.com/>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Mitul Limbani wrote:
> > >>> Brian,
> > >>>
> > >>> So if I m correct this would be a one of
> retail
> > customer
> > > who needs to
> > >>> call their indian partner company?
> > >>>
> > >>> Please email me in a bit more detail off the
> > list, coz we
> > > have helped
> > >>> several US based companies optimize their
> > communication
> > > cost to their
> > >>> indian counter part or indian offshore
> units.
> > >>>
> > >>> And I think we can help your customer too.
> > >>>
> > >>> Thanks & Regards,
> > >>> Mitul Limbani,
> > >>> Founder & CEO,
> > >>> Enterux Solutions Pvt. Ltd.,
> > >>> The Enterprise Linux Company (r),
> > >>> http://www.enterux.com
> <http://www.enterux.com/>
> > >>> http://www.entVoice.com
> <http://www.entvoice.com/>
> > >>>
> > >>> On 27-Oct-2009, at 7:30 AM, "Brian Franklin"
> > > <bfranklin at ntginc.net <mailto:bfranklin at ntginc.net>
> <mailto:bfranklin at ntginc.net <mailto:bfranklin at ntginc.net>>>
> > <mailto:bfranklin at ntginc.net <mailto:bfranklin at ntginc.net>
> <mailto:bfranklin at ntginc.net <mailto:bfranklin at ntginc.net>>>
> > >>> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>> I have an executive that needs low cost
> > minutes to a
> > > partner firm in
> > >>>> India. Clear calls and low cost is the
> > primary concern.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Brian
> > >>>>
> > >>>> -----Original Message-----
> > >>>> From:
> asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com>
> > <mailto:asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com>>
> > > <mailto:asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com>
> > <mailto:asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com>>>
> > >>>>
> [mailto:asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com>
> > <mailto:asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz-bounces at lists.digium.com>>] On Behalf
> > > Of mtlvoip
> > >>>> Sent: Monday, October 26, 2009 8:48 PM
> > >>>> To: Commercial and Business-Oriented
> Asterisk
> > Discussion
> > >>>> Subject: Re: [asterisk-biz] USA to India
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>> with what kind of features and in which
> level
> > of price
> > > are your
> > >>>> looking
> > >>>>
> > >>>> for?
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> --------------------------------------------------
> > >>>> From: "Brian Franklin"
> <bfranklin at ntginc.net <mailto:bfranklin at ntginc.net>
> > <mailto:bfranklin at ntginc.net <mailto:bfranklin at ntginc.net>>>
> > > <mailto:bfranklin at ntginc.net <mailto:bfranklin at ntginc.net>
> <mailto:bfranklin at ntginc.net <mailto:bfranklin at ntginc.net>>>
> > >>>> Sent: Monday, October 26, 2009 9:32 PM
> > >>>> To: "Commercial and Business-Oriented
> Asterisk
> > > Discussion"
> > >>>> <asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com>
> > <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com>>>
> > > <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com>
> > <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com
> <mailto:asterisk-biz at lists.digium.com>>>
> > >>>> Subject: [asterisk-biz] USA to India
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>> Looking for quality international SIP
> > > termination...particularly to
> > >>>>> India.
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> Any suggestions?
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>
> _______________________________________________
> > >>>>> --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by
> > > http://www.api-digital.com <http://www.api-digital.com/>--
> > >>>>> asterisk-biz mailing list
> > >>>>> To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit:
> > >>>>>
> > http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-biz
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>
> _______________________________________________
> > >>>> --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by
> > > http://www.api-digital.com <http://www.api-digital.com/>--
> > >>>> asterisk-biz mailing list
> > >>>> To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit:
> > >>>>
> > http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-biz
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> _______________________________________________
> > >>>> --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by
> > > http://www.api-digital.com <http://www.api-digital.com/>--
> > >>>> asterisk-biz mailing list
> > >>>> To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit:
> > >>>>
> > http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-biz
> > >>>>
> > >>>
> _______________________________________________
> > >>> --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by
> > > http://www.api-digital.com <http://www.api-digital.com/>--
> > >>> asterisk-biz mailing list
> > >>> To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit:
> > >>>
> > http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-biz
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >
> >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >>
> _______________________________________________
> > >> --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by
> > >> http://www.api-digital.com--
> > > <http://www.api-digital.com--/>
> > >> asterisk-biz mailing list
> > >> To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit:
> > >>
> > http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-biz
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by
> > >> http://www.api-digital.com--
> > <http://www.api-digital.com--/>
> > >>
> > >> asterisk-biz mailing list
> > >> To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit:
> > >>
> http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-biz
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> andy
> > >> andyspr at gmail.com <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com>
> <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com>>
> > <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com>
> <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com>>>
> > >>
> > >
> >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by
> > >> http://www.api-digital.com--
> <http://www.api-digital.com--/>
> > >>
> > >> asterisk-biz mailing list
> > >> To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit:
> > >> http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-biz
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by
> > http://www.api-digital.com--
> > >> <http://www.api-digital.com--/>
> > >>
> > >> asterisk-biz mailing list
> > >> To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit:
> > >> http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-biz
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> andy
> > >> andyspr at gmail.com <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com>
> <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com>>
> > <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com>
> <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com <mailto:andyspr at gmail.com>>>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >>
> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by
> http://www.api-digital.com--
> > >>
> > >> asterisk-biz mailing list
> > >> To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit:
> > >> http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-biz
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by
> http://www.api-digital.com--
> > >
> > > asterisk-biz mailing list
> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit:
> > > http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-biz
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by
> http://www.api-digital.com--
> > >
> > > asterisk-biz mailing list
> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit:
> > > http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-biz
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by
> http://www.api-digital.com--
> >
> > asterisk-biz mailing list
> > To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit:
> > http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-biz
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Thank you,
> >
> > -Wes-
>
> _______________________________________________
> --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com--
>
> asterisk-biz mailing list
> To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit:
> http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-biz
>
>
>
>
> --
> Thank you,
>
> -Wes-
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